Missing Episodes

[DJB]

I read on one of the forums this week that CAS(or someone associated)
have seven episodes from the pre '78 era that haven't  been released on
DVD.Does anybody know the relevant Episode numbers?

[Mike of CAS]

1815 - 1973 - Originally there was a full week of B&W ITC episodes.

Two seem to have only survived. 1885 was copied from film - along with the ones previously released on 1.1 to 1" Video Tape for the BFI

All three ITC episodes 1884-1886 were used in 'Open The Box' 1885 is visibly rewound on-screen in the programme with 'part two' and the opening shot of the Harvey house all seen.

This was later copied from the 1" to VHS for a Fan club event in Ross On Wye in 1989. So its gone missing recently. Or has been wiped by mistake or mis-labled.

2300 (1975) - Fan Club have sent a copy of this to ITV,  however its not the best copy and so is no doubt why its missed. The better copy again was with the 'ITC person'.

2814, 2815 (1977) and 2867 (1978) - although I was told that 2867 was mis-labled and has been found at the BFI.

There were also some 'Larry Grayson' tapes, but no one knows whats on those as they're on a format that can't be played.

Clips have been (some are still on), to prove the existence of these episodes, uploaded on You Tube.

[DJB]

Mike,
        Thanks a lot for all that information.Re.the "Larry Grayson" tapes,do you know if anybody has approached the KALEIDOSCOPE organisation with these.I believe that they have the necessary equipment to play virtually all obsolete formats and are very helpful and enthusiastic with anything involving archive telly.Also,isn't there meant to be an early 70s Christmas episode in existence somewhere.Do you know if ITV have a copy of this?

[Mike of CAS]

Yes I think the Larry tapes are trying to be sorted out, although I'm not that involved with tapes or that kind of things, but if there is any news on those I'll make sure its posted.

Christmas tapes - the 1980 ATV Christmas tape has the 'out-takes' of Rosemary shooting David.

There is another one with a spoof programme called "Noele Gordon's Leg's"

There are also some out-takes that survive: including the fire episode outside shots - Susan Hanson messing up a line with one of the crew commenting "Its alright, she's just auditioning for Coronation Street" and also raw footage of the QE2 and Meg's final moments in the motel before the fire all kept.

There is also the full 1981 ATV Party where Noele sings to a photo of Charles Denton complete and in the archive.

( I don't know if ITV have decent copies of the Christmas tapes - I assume not as LWT were trying to find the Rosemary shoots David cock-up for the ITV50 'Alright On The Night Special' and couldn't find it.)

[DJB]

Ta again,Mike.Re.the Christmas show- The one I heard about was an actual episode from the early 70s.Apparently it features Meg dressed as a clown and Diane sings!Ring any bells?

[Mike of CAS]

Yes, there has been a bit of a mix up over the years - and I've worked it out from photographs.

Christmas 1972 (wiped) had a fancy dress party at the motel - Meg was a clown and the special guest was Larry Grayson as Father Christmas.

The one where Diane sings survives - its Christmas 1978 (So we should get it soon on the DVDs. - well unless its gone missing since 1989 - as CAS again had it released on VHS - and Peter K has a copy..)

I've not seen it but Peter Kingsman says he's sure this is also the one which Noele Sings "Have Yourself A Merry Little Christmas."

I know we discovered some documents and music which indicated Noele also sung a song in the show in 1966, but as yet I can't find much more on that. (Jerry Allen and his TV Trio reunited)

Also some 'backing' music was found from the early 1970s with notes that it was used again for Noele to sing in the show. Now I did have the name of that song, but I can't find the bits of paper at the moment. Hmm!

[DJB]

Are you sure about this Mike?I may be wrong ,but I thought I'd read about the existence of the earlier(1972) show on more than one occasion.Also,hasn't the Christmas 1978 episode already been released on DVD-On Volume 3 of Network's original Best of series?

[Mike of CAS]

Yes we thought the one Peter Kingsman had was the 1972 one, but he's confirmed there isn't any fancy dress party its the 1978 one he has - which I think Nolly got copied for him at the time.

He did comment he also asked her for the episodes with "Summer Of My Life" in from 1976 but she knew even in 1978 those had been wiped.

[DJB]

That's disappointing news.I suppose there's still the possibility that the episode may be on the Larry Grayson tapes as he was in that one.The only other times that I recall him appearing was at Meg's wedding and as a difficult guest at the motel circa December 1973, if my memory serves me right.One other niggle remains ,however ,concerning the Christmas '78 show-there's no singing by either Meg or Diane on the DVD!

[Mike of CAS]

Yes I think its Christmas Eve - we've got Christmas Day on Volume 4 I think.

I suppose we'll soon know when we get to December 1978 with these releases. If its missing I'll have to speak with Peter about the copy he has.

[Mike of CAS]

Just checked Vol3 has episode 3069 which aired on Dec 26th.

So the singing ep should be from Dec 25th: VTR 6738/78: ep 3068.

ITs bad news for the wallets too, I've checked and all episodes are present from 2974 right to 3250 and even then its only two episodes lost. (3250 and 3253)

[DJB]

Re.Nolly having episodes copied for Peter-I read that the episodes from January 1977 on DVD Volume 6 were originally copied by ATV and given to Zeph Gladstone.I wonder how widespread this practice was at the time,prior to the advent of mass off-air recording.Makes you think that there could be a number of episodes out there, from that era ,with former cast members.On that subject, any idea how the two Zeph Gladstone episodes came to light?

[Mike of CAS]

Erm the Gladstone ones were discovered after she took them to be transferred to VHS (or DVD) so she could watch them, this of course long before she died. But The Video Ark I believe kept the N1500 tapes that were the original copies.

Yes there is possibly more out there, Peter thinks Simon May or Tony Blackburn may have some 1970s stuff.

Unfortunately there is no one at ITV prepared any longer to get involved, so they'll stay lost - unless May and the like will divulge such information to CAS, but having ITV do it always seemed to get much further, faster.

[Doltrice]

Well its unfortunate that due to outside forces searches have gone off, but it is always worth a try anyway to speak to these people.

Maybe the DVD company could seen as they've made this mess in the first place...

[Mike of CAS]

Well if you find contacts for these people you have to get past the publicist, and some of them see 'Crossroads' and don't pass the information on.

Difficult times ahead, as I say, we're back to 20 years ago and starting from scratch with this kind of thing.